Prepared by Ida Wrzesień from Kolegium Karkonoskie in Jelenia Góra

Speaker two - Dylan

Yes. My name is Doctor Dylan Foster Evans. I’m a lecturer in the School of Welsh,

Cardiff University. I’m originally from Monmouthshire from Ton in Monmouthshire and I’m a native Welsh speaker.

Q: Uh huh. What’s in your opinion is ... er ... perceived image of a Welsh person? What is an image of a Welshman? Or a Welshwoman, hm?

A: Um... I think it does vary and before I say anything it’s a very ... um ... fraught subject. Hm. And it’s very easy to find yourself, ... um ... if you’re making public pronouncements about what is or what is not Welsh, you’ll find yourself in trouble. Hm. (a cough) If you’ve not been called a racist or suggested that you are (a cough), I’m trying to close people out by saying anything. I think abroad, generally, Wales doesn’t seem to exist... um... in America or most of Europe. Yes, maybe in academic circles, of course but on the whole ... er ... most Welsh, Welsh people would find it very hard to describe why they are not English. But what does define Welsh people? Well, (a cough) for many people it will be the language and that does include Welsh speakers and non-Welsh speakers. Um... the language perhaps if you’re speaking to someone, say, from Americas. It is the easiest thing to say but it is different from English. This is absolutely different. And for non-spea..., for non-Welsh speakers as well, they will identify with the language even if they can’t speak it. Very often they will feel that the language is a key part of the Welsh identity. And the fact that they don’t speak Welsh doesn’t make them Welsh. Um... tut ... There are other characteristics, then, which tend to become almost clichés, really. Um ... things like the Welsh accent. Outside Wales, I think the Welsh accent is seen ... identified as the south-Welsh accent and, in a way, the Valleys accent. The accent of the South Welsh Valleys is seen as characteristic of the whole of Wales.

Q: Which is not true.

A: Which is no, not, by long way, is not true. It’s always strange, especially when you see Welsh people portrayed from outside Wales and they all have really the accent of area miles away from where they live. We perceive the Welsh accent as the Valley accent. Another thing - mining, mining industry again very strongly South Wales which has practically disappeared now. In a way it’s a backward looking identity there. Welsh people as rugby followers is another common image of again what is perhaps south Wales again. North Wales is more football, is soccer on the whole. But outside Wales, yes Wales is seen as a rugby playing nation. These things are in a way…, very even in Wales we don’t play rugby all the time. They’re not central to people’s lives in a way things like that …. Wales would formally have been seen as a strongly non-conformist country. Now I think now this country is the least religious part of the United Kingdom. But a hundred years ago there was a very, very strong feeling that Wales had a different religious identity, from England and obviously the Church of England was disestablished from  … . Now the Church of England is not an established church in Wales, as it is in England. But the difference is not really something most people would be aware of at all. Any more than people are aware of what is the difference between a Methodist, Wesleyan, Independent Church or Baptist church, people really don’t have much of an idea by now. So that’s looking back again that’s an old…, it would have been stronger years ago, and it’s declining hugely.

Q: Was there a reason, or a particular set of reasons why this has changed?

A: A very, very good question. Difficult one to answer. A hundred years ago this year there was a big religious revival in Wales. A very famous revival of chapels and churches were absolutely full and new members were waiting to get in almost literally fighting to get into a chapel. And that seems a very long way away now. Obviously western Europe has undergone a process of secularisation as a whole. The Welsh language which was strongly linked to many of the Nonconformist chapels has declined hugely. As well I mean has halved in the last century the number of the speakers. So Wales has a strong connection of religion and the Welsh language. So that dislocation has probably weakened things again. But the Welsh, even the Welsh speakers now, are not particularly religious any more than the English. I’m not a theologian but that’s a very interesting question. That’s one of the key markers of the 20^th century, the decline in religion.

Q: How much has the establishment of the National Assembly for Wales influenced the concept of Welsh identity?

A: Obviously, it seems to be leading to a more of a civic society where it doesn’t really matter whether you yourself feel Welsh or not. If you live in Wales you are a part of a civic society. You pay taxes going directly to the Assembly, you’d be voting in the Assembly and services would be provided by the Assembly within Wales, which should be different from England. So in that sense the Welsh identity has become less of an issue in one sense. In another sense, my personal impression is that the Assembly has made it much harder to discuss some things such as the language, the problem in a way is that the language tends to be seen as being linked to one political party in particular, Plaid Cymru and I get the impression that there are many politicians in Wales who are against Plaid Cymru and they would be usually attacking the language, not the language itself, but the Welsh speaking communities, as an attack on Plaid Cymru. I think it has become harder to discuss these things than five years ago. It’s very much harder now because there is a continual argument in Wales whether  different individuals are racist and it almost always tends to go round the Welsh language to some extent. And if you express strong opinions about the Welsh language if you feel it’s a bad thing, it’s declining. You have to be very, very careful to do that especially if you do that in a political way without attracting criticism that you are being racist against the English. Of course in Wales, English people there are more people born in England than there are Welsh speakers. So there’s  .. Wales of all the parts of the United Kingdom is the most mixed in a way only about 70 percent of people in Wales are from Wales by birth. Which is much lower than England or Scotland or Northern Ireland.

Q:  What attracts tourists to come to Wales?

A: I think it’s mainly the scenery, the national parks for walking, Snowdonia in particular. We’ve got the Brecon Beacons here. The history in general sense because it’s especially, you’ve got things like the castles, have you been to Carnavaron or Llanhilleth very, very striking. The history does attract people though I don’t think on the whole the culture does as such, it’s not a feature it should be but I don’t think it is. I think surveys have shown that people coming to Wales are pleasantly surprised that there are some parts where people actually speak Welsh. Would be surprised rather than been drawn for that. So I think that’s one thing we do badly I think that culture and tourism say you could be from Liverpool two hours and you could be living near a community that speaks another language, which I would have thought would encourage some people anyway to come and visit but I don’t think that’s an issue, that side of Welsh life is made very clear outside Wales.

Q: Do tourists romanticise Wales?   Merlin?

A: We all romanticise places we go on holiday because in a way that’s why we go there, we go on holiday because it’s different or more exciting, exotic. We perceive it to be more exotic than where we are from. Yes, the use of images, yeah they do encourage people to come and Merlin there’s a certain appeal for certain kind of what might be called New-Age or alternative lifestyles in Wales. Wales is closer to nature or away from the rat race, a very clean place, unspoiled. Although there is a problem in a way with that, these images of Welshness like Merlin things like that they’re not really important for the Welsh people themselves. It isn’t Merlin culture now, no not really they don’t really mean much culturally and we get things like King Arthur’s labyrinth which is probably a great place to go and visit. They don’t really have much to do with modern Welsh culture so there’s a danger of turning it into a theme park in a way. It’s not really Welsh culture that’s being brought to people’s attention. It’s a reinvention, through Hollywood and and various other things. I’m sure its same everywhere. It does. Modern Welsh culture isn’t really well known outside Wales and has never been presented outside Wales. So what people do look for is perhaps something that never was or has largely disappeared.